Unintended Acceleration

[lolder]

Read this article from the NYT last week: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/11/opinion/11schmidt.html?sq=bad%20brakes&st=cse&adxnnl=1&scp=1&adxnnlx=1268755346-vq/8qoKywOKiazHweontwQ.

Toyota floor mat problems? Yes. Sticky pedal problem? Maybe. All the rest? Probably not.

Edited March 17, 2010 by lolder

[sullied]

Read this article from the NYT last week: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/11/opinion/11schmidt.html?sq=bad%20brakes&st=cse&adxnnl=1&scp=1&adxnnlx=1268755346-vq/8qoKywOKiazHweontwQ.

Floor mat problems? Yes. Sticky pedal problem? Maybe. All the rest? Probably not.

I don't understand what this has to do with a Ford Fusion Hybrid in the least bit.

[lolder]

You're right. Although the last week the media has been raving about a runaway (Toyota Prius) hybrid. Maligning hybrids doesn't do the FFH any good either. Just some interesting car info.

[xmech2k]

Not directly related to the FFH, but still interesting. As an aircraft mechanic, I'm still puzzled why all cars don't have 'real' black boxes, so we know what controls were used when a car suddenly accelerated. I know, costs a little more per car, but how many people die each year in cars vs planes?

 

Thanks for posting this.

[acdii]

Not directly related to the FFH, but still interesting. As an aircraft mechanic, I'm still puzzled why all cars don't have 'real' black boxes, so we know what controls were used when a car suddenly accelerated. I know, costs a little more per car, but how many people die each year in cars vs planes?

 

Thanks for posting this.

 

The majority of new cars do have them, but since they contain proprietary information, special equipment is needed to retrieve the information, and only dealers can have that equipment. The one in the Prius has been read and it was determined the driver was playing a game with the gas and brake, something like 200+ pedal depressions over a short period of time. This story is looking more and more like a Hoax.

 

As far as the black box information, if an investigation requires it, the information can be retrieve via court order as necessary. They just need to get the proper reader to retrieve the information from it. In the last 5 cars I had, from the Prius to the Flex, there is a section regarding the black box. If I get a chance later and remember to do it, I will grab the book and post it.

[VonoreTn]

This is not a FFH issue, nor a Ford issue, and I don't like the fact that a connection is even suggested to those who won't read the article in full. Ford has enough legal issues to deal with regarding imaginary product shortfalls without suggesting a new one. I think this topic should be removed from the entire Ford forum for that reason.

 

Doesn't one of the 10 Commandments deal with not bearing false witness?

Edited March 17, 2010 by VonoreTn

[akirby]

The majority of new cars do have them, but since they contain proprietary information, special equipment is needed to retrieve the information, and only dealers can have that equipment. The one in the Prius has been read and it was determined the driver was playing a game with the gas and brake, something like 200+ pedal depressions over a short period of time. This story is looking more and more like a Hoax.

 

As far as the black box information, if an investigation requires it, the information can be retrieve via court order as necessary. They just need to get the proper reader to retrieve the information from it. In the last 5 cars I had, from the Prius to the Flex, there is a section regarding the black box. If I get a chance later and remember to do it, I will grab the book and post it.

 

What is interesting is that up until that incident, Toyota had stonewalled attempts to get that information in previous lawsuits, saying that it wasn't available or they couldn't read it, etc. In fact they only had one laptop in the U.S. capable of reading their own black box (according to Toyota - after the hearings they said they have 5). Other mfrs make their interfaces public and easy to access whereas Toyota has gone the other direction. I find it interesting that Toyota was able to get such detailed data so quickly when it benefits them. And now all of those previous lawsuits where Toyota said info wasn't available will be questioned, as it should.

[xmech2k]

I thought the current automotive black boxes only store a few seconds of data, and only 'lock' the data if the airbags deplay. But I don't know for sure. Apparently there must be a lot more if they got all that data from the Prius.

[acdii]

I thought the current automotive black boxes only store a few seconds of data, and only 'lock' the data if the airbags deplay. But I don't know for sure. Apparently there must be a lot more if they got all that data from the Prius.

 

The amount of data depends on the amount of memory available. I believe it will store several hours worth of inputs, as long as a crash did not occur, until the next engine restart, at which time the data gets overwritten. In a crash event the data gets locked into memory, precrash events for somewhere around 30-60 seconds worth, crash data, air bag deployment, deltas from various crash sensors, seat belt tensioners, and post crash data. All this information is more memory intense than pedal inputs and engine data. It all depends on the generation of BB installed. Earlier versions only had so much flash ram, but later generations take advantage of cheap ram now and can store a lot more data. Most of this is proprietary though, and only a dealer with the proper scanner can retrieve non crash data.

[lolder]

This is not a FFH issue, nor a Ford issue, and I don't like the fact that a connection is even suggested to those who won't read the article in full. Ford has enough legal issues to deal with regarding imaginary product shortfalls without suggesting a new one. I think this topic should be removed from the entire Ford forum for that reason.

 

Doesn't one of the 10 Commandments deal with not bearing false witness?

I apologize in that perhaps the topic title should be "No Unintended Acceleration" and I have edited the first post to say "Toyota". It is a FFH issue in that some news reports screamed "runaway Hybrid". I meant the topic to be supportive of all hybrids and to promote critical thinking about these reports.

Edited March 17, 2010 by lolder